Ogre AutoInstance? Poll

[Kannkor]

I've had plenty of people ask me about writing something that helps automate some instances. Let me explain specifically what I'm talking about first.
You (manually) zone into an instance. Type something (Ogre autoinstance ?), and the bot will greatly assist in clearing the zone. Once it's done, you are free to continue on etc. (Such as move onto the next instance) etc.

Things it would NOT do:
Reset zones
Repeat zones
Zone into zones
etc. I'm not trying to promote afk play here, because you will get into trouble at some stage for that.

Things it could do. Clear an entire (or most of) an instance.

Example:
You zone into Underdepths(manually).
Start Autoinstance, and you end up in front of dozekar (not instantly, but it clears it's way down there).
Then you take over and kill dozekar (I may automate that, but in this case, it falls into 'most of' an instance).

Creating automation for zones like Underdepths, is absolutely no small task. There are mobs that reset (like Theldak) if you pull from too far away. There's lips that you have to jump over to progress (Dagarn's room), there's portals to change floors, there's birds (to get to floor 3).
It is EXTREMELY tedious to code things like this.
Up to this stage, I've always just said no, the work just isn't worth the time invested... Then someone said the magic word... I'd pay something for it.

I want to be upfront and clear. This poll is to find out if people want this type of feature AND are willing to pay for it. This will 100% be an additional charge for those that want it (Kind of like OgreCraft, you can sub/unsub to it etc).

I've given it quite a bit of thought, and here's my thoughts (subject to change based on feedback etc).
Would be 1 set amount, for all 'Auto instances'. For example, lets say I created 2 right now, when I create the 3rd, it is automatically included etc. No additional oost.

Cost: Between $1-$2/month depending on how popular it is.

Note: It will never be required, this would be an optional feature for those interested.
Note: Same as Ogrecraft, you can cancel it if you decide you no longer want it.

This poll is exactly that, just a poll, not signing your life away.

Please post suggestions/comments.

 

[Garp74]

The beauty of OgreBot to me is it takes the automation tools and puts them out of the way. Players succeed, and fail, based on their knowledge and expertise with classes, spell orders, and importantly, strategies for encounters. It enables players to play the game in a new way, but it really doesn't play it for them. This feature crosses that line even more than something like golem.iss or other automation tools; it dumbs the OgreBot experience down to the lowest of common denominators: afk laziness.

I know, I know: to each their own. I live my life by that, so if it's something you want, so be it. I don't have to use it. But I think your time, Kannkor, could be better spent by improving the bot in other ways, further enriching the experiences of those who, you know, actually play the game.

Just my opinion.

 

[Quigly4000]

I'd probably pay up to 5 bucks for a feature like this (so 1-2 bucks would be a no brainer for me) based on how useful the zones end up being to farm in this manner. UD for example is appealing to me now because I would use it to farm shards/dozekar heads. Can't say I see an issue with "dumbing down" the ogre experience as you'll still need to gear and setup your characters appropriately beforehand... this would just take out the monotony of farming ezmode zones which are already be run easily while watching tv and steering the tank. This would just remove the steering!

Perhaps you could consider selling the scripts for a separate one time cost as opposed to a subscription that grants use to all of them. Not sure if that would be more/less financially bneeficial to you but I can see a subscription model for this type of service being a hindrance for some since its not necessarily the type of thing that people are likely to use on a long term basis. I am of course just one example.. but i could see subscribing to this.. utilizing it to farm UD till i've had my fill and just wanting to cancel. I'd still subscribe but maybe there are people that would be turned off by a subscription to something that may not have lasting appeal for them? i dunno. Just some thoughts!

 

[Kevinshp]

I agree with Garp74 for the most part your time could be used elsewhere like raid instructions for your raid settings . but I would like it for some other instances to help level new toons while I am raiding on my main could send three toons into a zone clear it do the next as for new zone It would be nice for the same sort of thing CD is so boring to me now but still want myths so I do it.

If you did some of the old zones would be great and I would pay for for leveling a toon which I hate grinding toons with a passion so having something I could semi afk IE running a group through a hard zone while ogre pushes a grinding group through another. would be cool.

 

[Kannkor]

I'd probably pay up to 5 bucks for a feature like this (so 1-2 bucks would be a no brainer for me) based on how useful the zones end up being to farm in this manner. UD for example is appealing to me now because I would use it to farm shards/dozekar heads. Can't say I see an issue with "dumbing down" the ogre experience as you'll still need to gear and setup your characters appropriately beforehand... this would just take out the monotony of farming ezmode zones which are already be run easily while watching tv and steering the tank. This would just remove the steering!

Perhaps you could consider selling the scripts for a separate one time cost as opposed to a subscription that grants use to all of them. Not sure if that would be more/less financially bneeficial to you but I can see a subscription model for this type of service being a hindrance for some since its not necessarily the type of thing that people are likely to use on a long term basis. I am of course just one example.. but i could see subscribing to this.. utilizing it to farm UD till i've had my fill and just wanting to cancel. I'd still subscribe but maybe there are people that would be turned off by a subscription to something that may not have lasting appeal for them? i dunno. Just some thoughts!

The problem with 1-time fees, is these take so long to do, and it doesn't promote ongoing production, other than for the next "bang for the buck". Whereas, a subscription usually makes me maintain and continue developing.

To test things, I'm making one for UD (I had started it the other day). If I get it working "well" I'll release it as a test so people can test and see exactly what I mean. Then we'll go from there. (The test would be free, otherwise it wouldn't really be a test).

I would guess that 99% of zones done, would be current content zones. If you're PLing, almost every other zone can already be done with a simple autohunt path. There's generally nothing special that has to be done. Of course, as new xpacs come out, and content becomes "old", the auto instance for those zones would still exist, but production of new auto instance would definitely be first developed for current content (unless there was a reason for an old one that benefited the majority).

 

[kimble]

I like the idea, I don't see who it would hurt, if you don't want the easy mode you don't buy it, simple.

I'm still a noob with Ogre tho, and lack the group power to tackle UD yet, maybe by the time this is written I'd be geared/skilled enough to make use of it I can only hope. For now I'd just settle with a script that can handle the Ovilas fight and stop me dying from the AE after a knockback I'm guessing I just lack the dps tho.

 

[Rooster]

Not all of us run with a full group. UD is be beyond my reach with my duo.. but some help with PR would be useful for those of us with smaller duo/trios.

SOH would be worth considering too actually. PR is close to being do-able with an autohunt path, but there's a few too many scripted events which would prevent an autohunt path from working. Same with SOH. The tank would aggro the 5 sisters instead of waiting for the "Eye of the sisterhood" script to run its course. It wouldn't take much scripting to fix that though.

I think you'll get a better uptake if you include that type of content, so you have something for full group players as well as duo/trio players.

 

[dtgreer]

I like the idea and would be more then willing to pay the $1-$2.

I agree about the optional subscription idea.

My personal preference of zones? Glad you asked....

- UD
- HM's (CD/LYC/Prime)

 

[Kannkor]

I like the idea and would be more then willing to pay the $1-$2.

I agree about the optional subscription idea.

My personal preference of zones? Glad you asked....

- UD
- HM's (CD/LYC/Prime)

Some complex fights may not be doable until you can completely overgear them. It's pretty easy to set campspots and what not, but if a mob moves odd or places really poorly and is frontaling your group, it will kill them. At this stage, I don't see myself writing anything to properly place mobs, because of how shitty pathing is in-game.

I was actually working on one for CD-EM, but it was a total pain in the ass with the layout, even with a very tight follow, people were getting stuck like mad. I do have some ideas to alleviate this issue, but I deemed it at the time, just not worth the time investment for myself.

SOH would be worth considering too actually. PR is close to being do-able with an autohunt path, but there's a few too many scripted events which would prevent an autohunt path from working. Same with SOH. The tank would aggro the 5 sisters instead of waiting for the "Eye of the sisterhood" script to run its course. It wouldn't take much scripting to fix that though.

Some basic SOH/PR should be relatively easy. What I mean by basic, is using of items, waiting for sisters to spawn, etc. But ultimately, the fights themselves would still be overlevel/overgear. (Which I'm guessing is 99% of what people are doing now).

 

[dtgreer]

Yeah I can only imagine the issues with pathing etc. I see it while controlling one of the toons.

I would definitely be interested and like the idea of a separate optional subscription model.

Out of curiosity, what zones besides UD were you thinking of trying to develop?

 

[ClassicCoke]

From a technical point of view, a hey how does this AI work, and an isn't this cool factor, and the challenge of getting something like this to work sounds like fun to me. I've always loved this type of thing and wish I could spend hours tuning/tweaking it.


But from a game standpoint, this just crosses the line too much into unattended gameplay to me.


Maybe there is a middle ground where there could be 'improved encounter scripting' tools that will help people write/share their own encounters? Don't give out the full zone running scripts but write some advanced tools people could get access too.


I also think overall the cost for Ogre is a pretty good deal and I don't mind the subscription price at all. I'd be willing to pay a higher subscription cost for more programming time/features as well. Its my hobby and I enjoy it. Its the kind of thing I wish I had the time to tinker with myself.


However, I do REALLY wish the actual Sony EQ2 team had something like this to test new raid encounters with, instances, etc. So hey if they are some of the ones offering to ponying up the money for their own testing staff...more power to the idea



Classic Coke

 

[chaosrune]

I would support the idea even though id prolly never use it. Ogre has brought back alot of fun to the game for me and my wife and i would hate to see kannkor get bored and stop.

 

[Akin]

I would pay in a heartbeat. I think it would be great to remove some of the grind of running the easy mode zones. I would like to see all of the SS zones and maybe the cash zones. PR Shard Etc...

 

[permits]

I'd very happily pay a monthly sub for zone clearance in UD, as it is really tedious after doing it a few times, and I enjoy OB primarily as it allows me to mess around doing dumb stuff at keyoard and then do the annoying stuff while watching TV. I've got a shed load of toons that need heads for gear etc, and the thought of going through UD all those times is nauseating.

I'd be interested in what other zones would be look at for this. I've not got a 6 man team up and running yet, I just go with 3 and mercs but I do a lot of old world content for mutes etc.

I'd be interested in an autoclear option for SF/DoV part1 raid zones x 2 and 4 for farming shards etc.

I guess that all future dungeons would be done, but not HM stuff as you mentioned earlier in the post.

I'd pay up to an additional say 5$ a month for it.

 

[Kannkor]

Really great feedback, and it definitely seems like the majority (80%+ last time I checked) was in favour of it.

It's not something that will happen over night, (and still no promises of it ever happening, but it seems likely). As I get time, I'll continue to work on getting one done and released so people can see how it works.

 

[jgarza00]

Personally, automation fascinates me. I don't AFK because I actually enjoy watching my Ogre setups perform. I monitor ACT while my group fights and am always tweaking this, that, and the other. I would pay and use this feature, although I can completely understand the point of the first reply back on page one. Would a feature like this bring undesired attention to the "Ogre" community? I often wonder how many of us are "flagged" on patch day when the IRC topic changes and the mass login hits SOE servers LOL. Anyway, I think all you do is phenomenal, and I do agree there are other facets of Ogre that could be taken in new directions and would even pay for future developments there. Ultimately, I want you to be happy so we keep getting your awesome-sauce programs!

=D

 

[Rooster]

I'm away from the game at the moment, thinking about coming back.. did this autoinstance ever get implemented?

I'm hoping it did. It's been a few months... fingers crossed!

 

[fl0pster]

Id easily is willing to pay up to 5 bucks more a month for this type of feature. Yes it in a way promotes afk botting but at the same time it takes away the mundane farming of zones... Do the ends justify the means? I'd say yes...

It would be interesting to see how this would be done since you have so many variables for certain fights but I’m sure kannkor can handle it

I say go for it.

\btw sorry for bumping a somewhat old post

 

[Kannkor]

Id easily is willing to pay up to 5 bucks more a month for this type of feature. Yes it in a way promotes afk botting but at the same time it takes away the mundane farming of zones... Do the ends justify the means? I'd say yes...

It would be interesting to see how this would be done since you have so many variables for certain fights but I’m sure kannkor can handle it

I say go for it.

It currently isn't implemented. I haven't had the time to spend to build some good framework for it yet. although AutoHunt got a good sized upgrade (which was phase 1 of this process).
When I get some more time I'll look into it again.

What zones would people want as a starting base, all the new heroic ones?

 

[davebob35]

Currently I am most interested in PR and SoH (still need plat to get masters), then after that new Heroic Instances. Been away at a wedding the last 5 days but hope to try my hand at scripting for at least PR and SoH. Hope to get you my latest attempt at movement when I get home tonight.

 

[fl0pster]

Id say start with the easiest and work your way to the harder ones to script..

 

[movieman]

Running ST with challenge mode mobs to get prime phalacs would be very beneficial. Those sell for quite a lot of plat.

 

[Rooster]

What zones would people want as a starting base, all the new heroic ones?

One thing to consider Kannkor might be to a "toolkit" that will allow Ogre uses to create and contribute autoinstance scripts for zones. All it would take is a few Ogre users with some skill and passion and you'll get a bunch of quality levels contributed without having to lift a finger.

The biggest obstacle for a lot of us is scripting the bits like "pause the movement script here, wait for XX text, then right click and select X, wait for X condition, then continue movement script to the next waypoint".

Yes there will be fights that require scripts, such as clicking the sounding staff columns in PR or something.. maybe some kind of UI that helps us create scripts for fights. If fighting mob named XXXX, when X condition is true, such-and-such toon should do this action until Y condition.

There's bound to be a way to do this that would allow the community to contribute and take the load off your shoulders. A comment/rating system would allow the Ogre community to filter the good/bad contributed scripts.

Something to think about - I thought it might allow us to end up with a greater number of scripts for a greater variety of zones, and would take the job off your hands each time SOE add new zones.

I know that I for one would be very keen to contribute. I'm good with coding, I wrote my own custom script which completely handles combat for my main toon and I use Ogre for the rest of my group. It will not be something every Ogre user could/should do, but there's bound to be a few competent users amongst us who would love to contribute quality content for your product.

I don't know, maybe start with coding a few zones yourself, see how popular it is, and go from there... or canvass opinion on the idea from some of your longest term users who you think would have the skill set to help contribute zones, see if it might interest them?

 

[DaggerSplicer]

The bots pretty much do all the work for us, other than avoiding the obstacles and leading the path along with following the scripts. This really is nothing short of afk fighting which you said yourself not to be incouraged. I like some others think that your time while appecriated would be better invested into coding raid mob scripts or what-nots. If the community votes a yes on this you have my support if you deemed it necessary to follow through. A dollar or two more is well worth the investment for such a great tool that you have developed for us, even if I am reluctant to use it, having it on-hand never hurts either.